Podflix & Chill
Podflix & Chill

Episode · 1 year ago

Chilling with Extraction Fight Coordinator - Michael Lehr

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

On this week's episode, I got the opportunity to chat with stuntman and fight coordinator, Michael Lehr. Michael is no stranger to the stunt world, having worked on notable projects like John Wick 2 & 3, Logan, Fate of the Furious, and many more. In our chat, we discuss: 

  • His role as Fight Coordinator on the Netflix film, Extraction 
  • Working with Chris Hemsworth and stunt legend, Sam Hargrave 
  • Stunt doubling Yoson An in Mulan for Disney+ 
  • His martial arts background and training

Follow Michael on Instagram

Watch Michael in the "oner" from Extraction

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What's going on? Guys? Welcome back to Pod flicks and chill. As always, I am your host, Andrew, and we have a great show for you. Today. I got a chance to sit down and talk with stuntman and fight coordinator Michael Lair, who has a list of over seventy credits to his stunting career. These roles include films such as John Wake, two and three, the debt collector was Scott Adkins, as well as fate of the furious and the upcoming furious nine film. Now we mainly talk about his fight coordinator credit on last year's Netflix Action Film Extraction, starring Chris Hemsworth. We talked about his stunt doubling role on the Disney plus film Mulan, and we get into our shared interest in working out and our shared background of martial arts. Before we get started in this interview, feel free to hit subscribe wherever you're listening to this podcast or watching, because it's now on Youtube, and make sure you stay notified for when we drop future episodes. Until then, I hope you guys enjoyed this interview with Michael Lair. What's going on, Michael? How are you doing? All Right? Man? How are you, brother? I've doing all right. Is it Nice there in Hawaii? It's gorgeous. It's absolutely fantastic. Yeah, it's sort of like a weird almost like a paid vacation working at it and no complaints there. And in Jersey, where I'm at right now, it's about forty five degrees. So, Oh man, I remember that. Whether yeah, for sure. Like I lived in Ohio for like eleven years in the whole Oh wow, the whole winters would just go bonkers. Is Super, super cold. So hike, I imagine. Know that it is further northeast. Yeah, it's pretty bad. And you're in La now. When you're not in when you're not shooting, typically, yeah, which is okay outside of covid times. It's very rare for me to be back at home for extending pretty time. But yeah, I was able to be in La last year for like six months uninterrupted, which was pretty you know, obviously it's in terrible circumstances, but it's you know, it was nice to sort of be home for once and, you know, Experience California. Whether, yeah, that is that is pretty neat. So streaming is kind of like at an all time high, especially with, as you mentioned, covid times in the pandemic and everything like that, and you actually were pretty lucky to be part of one of what I think is one of the biggest streaming films last year, which was extraction, starring Chris Hemsworth. Can you talk a little bit about your experience on that? I knew you were the fight coordinator, but just walk me through what that film was like and what you did sort of day to day? Yeah, yeah, it was. It was super cool. That was like a really big I was really flattered when they asked me to come and do that. Oh my gosh, she's this. That that is my cat, Mr Bond. He hates, he hates whenever I'm like talking to a camera, so he'll just hop right up into my life. is so little. It's so cute. I don't know this. Yeah, we we got them. He was seven months old. We got him from the rescue shelter. Yeah, so we got him right after Christmas and he's he's been great. He was really shy at first and now he's like he begs for attention like a dog. Yeah, I'm willing to bet that every time you do one of these videos and if he pops up, it's going to steal show. It's going to be amazing. That's like probably. I love when they're like, you know, I watch like youtube channels and stuff, like people are doing these kinds of interviews or they're just like, you know, walking doing their own thing, and if they ever have pets and they just randomly jump into the shot, it's you see the whole thing derail for like thirty seconds and it's great. I love it. I loved the debt. So that's all. Definitely the star of the the start of this video will be will be bond. All right. So back to the extraction. Sorry, yeah, the you're fine. Yeah, it was. It was a really cool opportunity. I was super stoked to do it. It was like kind of my first job is like the soul fight coordinator right out the gate and for the entire run of it on a big feature, especially with, you know, the team that was running that show. You know, you got like Sam hargrave making his main unit directtional of the debut and you know he's like a stunt legend. You know, it's like one of those things where he'd been in the industry for so long and a lot of us, you know, we all knew him like growing over, like watching him and stuff, like trying to see how he was doing stuff and him with like a...

...lot of the guys on his team and everything. So yeah, I was I was super blessed to be able to go in on that one. What I can say about is that it was it was a lot of work. It was was very, very hard, you know. I mean it's you're shooting over and like other countries, for a long braid of time and and it almost felt like an indie project that sometimes you know, because like you're watching your director literally take the camera and do a bunch of stuff and you're just hanging out with a lot of buddies and your chorographing all these crazy fights and stuff. But yeah, a lot of it was I'd say movies like that they're they're built on the backs of people who are, you know, really passionate, who put a lot of energy into it, because there's there's a pretty simple premise of that film. You know. It's almost like something like a kin to like the raid or whatever, where you set up a premise at the beginning of movie, you watch it run all the way forward and if the action doesn't work like the I don't think the film really works. You know, it's like, yeah, you get lucky with those things if you have people like Christen's worth who can pull off all the action very, very easily. You know, it's like he was bizarrely good at choreography, like you see in this store, obviously, and like he's got a lot of you know, physical like coordination and he can handle action. But the stuff for extraction, he picked it up so quick within like two takes he would have everything memorize and so it made you know, yeah, like training and rehearsing with them just very, very cool, you know. And I guess I wasn't too worried about how the performances would be when we actually started shooting it and I was like this is going to look really good, so I'm not too stressed about this whole thing. You know, is a lot of work, but it was. It was a lot of work in you know, like what I would say like the right way. You know, it's like you're just with your buddies and you're making cool stuff and having a ball. So yeah, I really enjoyed the time on it. That's awesome. Yeah, I remember I follow Sam on Instagram and that's how you and I actually connected, and it was crazy seeing literally he's attached to the front of the car, just like filming, and all the the he posted rehearsal footage of you guys going through the stunts and the coordination, and it was like it was just like a dance. It was really it was really well done, and I think that's what I what made me appreciate that film so much. Like you says, it's kind of like an indie project, but like the action sequences were just perfect. Yeah, it's a lot of guys kind of getting together and being on the same page and really, you know, having sort of a singular vision, and you know, like Sam was really good about that, like his vision for the action, and we all the fact we all trusted him and we all knew that. How you know he was gonna, you know, be able to bring this to life and make it fun and exciting. You know, you look at his breadth of work and and it's one of those things where when he tells you like, okay, we're going to do a big warner, like, I think in the script, if I remember correctly, about that big one or sequence the end of the first act is it's not written to be like a one take sequence. It's it's basically written is like these things sort of happened the general idea of it, but it's almost like when you read a script and it just says and then they fight and then it's like the end of like drunken master too or something really like yeah, they fight. They fight like seven and a half minutes, like that's that's not a screenwriting thing, that's your choreography team, your action design is like going off the chain with the end, with that that big one er and extraction. Like when they told me that that was what they were going to do, I was like, Oh, yeah, I'm down. You know, you look at the work that they've done with winners before, like you said, like atomic blonde. You know that whole sequence at the end is fantastic. So I was like it's one of the greatest ones. Yeah, you know, for me that was like a I keep I've said it in like other than interviews to but it's almost like stunt, like a c type stuff, like where if I can say that I was part of that, I thought people, you know, at the time, especially I was like, I feel like people are going to be talking about this for a while, so I really just kind of savor the ability that there, the the opportunity rather to just kind of be a part of it. And, yeah, you just know it's going to end up being pretty good and pretty cool. So you know you can walk in there with confidence and just do your job. That's great. How long did it actually take you to develop that one or and was it like just you, or was it you in a like a bunch of other people? I mean I played like a role in it, but you know, obviously, like the whole thing was it was Sam's vision, you know, in the whole team kind of. You know, it all trickles down from there. You know, he has his idea for it, then we're all...

...trying to help him, you know, find those spots which could happen. But for the most part I feel like he he more or less like hattered in his head almost from the get go. Like a lot of those things are dictated by the set design and things like that, which, you know, we were shooting on actual locations for most of it, like I don't think any of it was done and on stages. So you know, you have to make sure that everything sort of fits and blends in, because there's times when, like, you're in one location, the camera will whippan and it goes to a completely different building. But you know they've gone through this door and now it's a different building. It's but supposed to be the same one, but it's totally different, different, you know location, I gosh. And so you're trying to plan how those things, you know, geographically, kind of work with each other to justify everything. I mean it all ends up being like sort of seeing, listen to works and flows together, especially with a car jason stuff ending in different areas of the city and what have you. But the prep for that actually started. That was the first thing that we started tackling. Like I remember getting the phone called for it. I was, strangely, is irony brons. I was in Hawaii working on five oh when again, Stevens, the the coordinator, called me up. You know, I'd work with them on Logan and like rieving and battle angel, like I you know it, work with them a whole bunch of times and he was saying hey, so I went to come Fike cording this thing. You know, if you'd be down, but we know we're going to get started like pretty soon, so I can September, like literally like a few weeks afterwards. We were already prepping in Los Angeles, working on the sequence and we knew right away that the thing was the warner is going to be coming up, like that's the first thing that we're going to really start tackling. So it was a more about getting all the fight stuff even like when we're in Los Angeles and we're like putting boxes down to like simulate the hallways were we sort of know what the layout of the place going to because they scouted it. Yeah, but you don't know exact dimension, so you're still sort of guessing. So you don't know what's really possible with the camera yet as far as moving around, and things are going to always change. But when we, you know, when we started shooting over pre visualization stuff and Sam had a chance to look at it, you know, they they were very good about letting us know like okay, well, this is the the direction you have to go, because this is going to happen over here, etcetera, etc. But for the most part the structure of it was was very much in the beginning, like we knew exactly where we were going to be transitioning to things. We did know how it was all going to flow together, and so we got we got sort of working on that right away. But that one or definitely was was I think it was probably like I could be getting it wrong, but I will want to say it was something like a month and a half of prep just for that. Like we shot, we prepped it in La then we prepped it overseas and then we prepped it like on location, like we were on stages and we're doing it on location. You know, like that big high fall that they do where they come out the over the balcony on the audien until the down hit the truck and hit the street and get up a night fight in the streets. That that whole stunt had to be rehearsed and prepped and, you know, you have to set up how the camera is going to go over the railing and fall down with them and everything. All that stuff is very, very, like intricately planned, you know, to make sure it's all, you know, like safe, but then also like looks good and you know, visually and like it's esthetically pleasing to serve the action. Yeah, I definitely took took quite a while and then I think it was like either it was it was either three or four weeks of like shooting just on that sequence, because there's there's cars and there's explosions and then there's, you know, like all the fights and everything that happened different spots. Sure, yeah, it was a lot. It was definitely a lot. Yeah, but it but, as you said it, you can tell sort of how much work and how much prepped that you guys put into it, because the the finished product was absolutely in I don't understand how it didn't win the favorite action movie for two thousand and twenty honestly, because you guys put in a lot of work. I feel like in terms of streaming, the only other one that may might have come close was the old guard. Did you see that one? I did. I did. Yeah, actually, I know a lot of the guys that that worked on that our because it's a lot of those guys or from the eighty seven eleven action design team. Until they're okay, they're just tops. You have been working with those guys for four years, since John Wick too, and they're actually even slightly before that. Not Anything about it and they they were. I mean they just have a very good system for they they know how to get a movie to have good action.

There's just the whole process of where they they understand how to train the actors. They understand how to, you know, get the right set up for all the shots and everything, how to serve the director and it's just fantastic stuff. So yeah, I thought I thought the old God was really cool. You know, it was definitely a wild like a lot and there's some wild concepts stuff happening and there yeah to that. And you're telling the story and those kinds of movies through the action, which I think is always the the fun challenge of it. You know. I it's like every action piece is still a piece of the narrative, you know, and if it's just action for Action Sake, then it sort of dies, you know. So, yeah, this is a little bit yeah, the stakes aren't there, but the old guard they did a really good job of like keeping that high and of course you got someone like Charlie's you know, that whole cast was like they seem like they were really down to just put the time in understand how the action worked and you know, that's when you can see the payoffs in it. You know, something like, you know, like how Keanu reeves does it in wick or like how, you know, Ham's worth did in an extraction. You know, they they put the time in because they really cared and they it really does show, you know, on camera you can tell when an actor really like doing their own action. So yeah, it's I've seen those behind the scenes featurettes of of Keano training with like the Machado brothers, just like hours of Jiu Jitsu and judo and all this other stuff, like every single day. It's it's ridiculous. Yeah, I was there for a good portion of that on the second movie and really yeah, watching him, watching him go through there's actually like when we were working in that movie, there was a guy named Eric Brown who's a good friend of mine, great, great choreographer, a great action designer, incredible martial artist, you know, used to be a pro fighter and everything, and he he spent a lot of time with Keanu as well training them. Iked I was there. I sort of like his ookie, you know. I was like a purple belt. Yeah, it's with the time. So I was letting him, you know, like put some missions on me and everything and throw me around and Eric, you know, is a fantastic martial artist, was really really getting him good on the on the like the foundationary skills, you know. So at that point, at the end of like the training that they had done, you could almost have given Keanu like a blue belt or something because he was just so good. You know, it's gonna ask. That's awesome. Just legitimately like knew a bunch of stuff. It was so cool. That is really cool. Now you bring up something that I wanted to ask you about your martial arts experience. To you said you're a you've trained in Jiu Jitsu. Obviously. Do you train in other martial arts and how, like, how active are you in terms of like learning new stuff, because obviously you're working all the time on film and TV series. Yeah, I'm not as active as I used to be in terms of like trying to learn new stuff these days. I feel like I'm trying to hold on to the stuff that I read I used to be good at. But yeah, my my training originally, I you know, when I when I first started training like as a teenager, we trained in like a take window school, but it was very much like like a contemporary like almost MMA school. You know, we were doing like all the poems say and stuff. We're doing all the forms, all the traditional stuff, but then, you know, in flying kicks and board breaks and all that junk. But then, you know, like for my like my like Green Belt Test, and take one though, we were doing like okay, Guillotine, like from the from the like someone would shoot on you have to sprawl, pick them up guillotineam you know, and finish the submission like Guillotine escapes. You know, we were doing like beginning, like knife and stick stuff like Collie, and then we know we're heavy, like in the end of the Moy Tis, you doing like leg shields and like elbows and plums on guys, like throwing knees into the pads, like yeah, so this is like take window and I go to other tech when thow schools and they're like yeah, no, we don't, we don't do that stuff. Will Punch, but like we don't do that. We don't do any like clinch or grappling or wrestling, you know. So anyway it was like sort of at that time in like the late you know, it like late s early two thousands, where like hybridization of Mar starts would become really popular. I digress a little bit, like the the point I guess in trying to make is that it set me on this path of thinking that there's no sort of like one style that you should really learn. You know everyone's going to be you want to make sure that the mar starts is sort of serving you. You know what I mean? Like you, it's not even is going to be great at everything, so you take sort of what works for you. And for me I was like I always love the idea of like diversity. You know, I grew up playing like video games and stuff. You're playing like street fight and you're watching all these different styles and playing tech in and playing like mortal comedy.

Like I kind of just want to know all this stuff, so let me just go and bike figure it out. And that first school like really set me on that path, you know, like where I learn other things and not feel like I was I was ruining sup I like to call myself like a Jack of old trades, master of none, maybe not even a decent at a lot of stuff, but yeah, I I ended up with a few different black belts and different things but yeah, the I really love, you know, Jiu Jitsu of judo. Collie obviously, you know, really really big on like, you know, just just m MAS UFF in general, like Muytai wrestling. But you know, I did like couple weight or for like three years in there and and that was like Super Fun. I did WHO's she was like eight months and stuck at it. So you know, the I guess is as a stunt person, when you started going into like chartagraphing fights, the ideas that you want to be as the verse as possible because you never know what what's going to serve you in that moment, what makes makes sense for those characters. You know, it's some people get trapped into doing sort of just their own thing. But you know, if you look at it, no script is going to be the same, no character is going to be the same, and you want to you want to make sure that you're tailoring it so that the you know, the actors also like kind of have a unique spin on it that they're comfortable with. And you know, yeah, it's word all those dens like a you do the same thing too many times, people get bored with it. You know, that's why we moved on from like, you know, as great as Jackie Channel was, people eventually wanted to see like, you know, what Jetley did, what Donnie ended what you know, when Tony Jock came, he took the whole scenes. You have these like weird eras of like a martial arts take over, and you know, in the the trend changes and I guess our job is always be sort of at the forefront of that trend, which is why, you know, having multiple black belts, multiple you know, like years of training different disciplines really sort of serge you in that. In that regard, yeah, it's almost like the the Bruce Lee mentality of, you know, absorbing what you need and getting rid of everything else that doesn't make sense. Yeah, letting it serve you exactly exactly. Now, did you get a chance to interact much with Donnie en on Mulan? No, actually, so Mulan is great, because I feel like I was bad about it. So I think a lot of people did. I did more that. I did more stuff in it than I really did. I was I only doubled the main like guy for it, Yo son, for just the like three weeks of the reshoots. That was in Los Angeles was like the movie is basically already done. They just wanted to add a few more things to it and I came in and double them just for that scene. And it was he was so good at his own action that I almost I don't think I even like some of the stuff they clearly were not going to use me for. It was like yeah, put Mike in there, what he'll do it. Just to be safely, as I know this guy's really good. I'm not doing it any better than he is. So right, right, yeah, but yeah, that's like so I think the the you know, we I did get to meet the main actress, like you, who played Mulan, and the I obviously that Mike, my actor, and some of the other cast. But no, I didn't get the chance to meet some of those big, big names from the old Marsil Arts community that I was that I'm superstoked. APP will all say that like Oh, I was like one degrees separation away, like we were in the movie it. Oh Man, I can die happy. I was in a movie where like Donnie and was in it, like yet he was in you know, the kind of stuff you know. So, yeah, that is pretty cool. I do like that. I said, I think it was crossed. You know, someday, Hey, you never know. So I and that's the thing I noticed too with a lot of because I follow a lot of stunt people on instagram. I think it's such a fascinating profession, one that I've liked toyed with. Do I want to do this, do I not want to do this, like because I have a little bit of a martial arts background and I'd probably be really good at like bad guy number one. But I just love the community aspect, how all of you guys seem to either know each other or there you guys really support each other. I always see you sharing from sharing other people's stories or posts or the work that they've done, and I think that's just such a neat part of the stunt community. Yeah, communities. It's actually the reason why I got into stunts. Honestly,...

...like I feet me, I was like I went to school for for theater and to be like an actor, you know what I mean. I trained in acting before, even before I started doing martial arts. By the only reason I started doing martial arts was because you didn't see any male Asian actors doing any acting unless they were also doing like a jump kick at the same you know what I mean, like it was just one of those things where, yeah, I looked at all, which is a forty. Yeah, it's a shame, though, isn't it? Like it is in I I guess in a way, the silver lining of is that it turned beyond too martial arts way more. You know that I have may have been interested in you know, I had I not been persueing that craft. You know, it's all things sort of happen for reason, I suppose, when you end up looking at it, good or bad. But the yeah, like when I when I was trying to, you know, do my acting thing in Los Angeles, like back in like the on the late two thousands, like two thousand and sevent, two thousand and eight, two thousand and nine, I was getting a lot of roles like doing even like motion capture, something where I would be working with a lot of stunt people. You know, I might have like a few scenes here and there, but then I would also be doing some action. Like motion capture sort of has that where they want people who are kind of like, you know, who can act a little bit, who are at least good physical actors. But then also people who are you cable doing like the fight stuff and you know, whatever stuntuff is needed for those things, you know, because it's one thing to be someone who can like do a big flip, but then if you also have to land and like act like you're like a creature or something like that, it's like, Oh, you know someone who's comfortable doing that as well. You know who's got to got that that in the repertoire. But because of that, I kept meeting a lot more like sun performers and I just sort of felt like, you know, drawn to the to that side of the community. You know, it's like when you train with them, there's that mentality of like all right, so we're going to do like a we're going to work on the clips today, and if someone comes and talks about doing flips, like okay, cool, let's go train them. And then if you find out that they're like Oh, well, you know, I'm I used to do it, blah, blah, blah, like okay, so I guess you were a liar, like I don't know. And then, you know, most stunt people like if if they say they can do something physically, you're kind of allowed to call them out on it. You know what I mean, like if, especially if you're training with them and if they're if they're full of it, you kind of just rush into the side. You know, that's the thing where we're not everyone has to be like a phenom. Not everyone's going to be that person that's doing like all the crazy, you know, moves and the being all the hotspots. But you know, even being like like bad guy number one or, in my case, like number nineteen or something down on the culture. You know, if you got to run in and like get hit, it's like you know you're going to have to fall down and you're going to you know, you can't really talk like a big game. And if, even if your movies, like I come in and I throw one spin kick and then the guy punched me in the face. You know, if you get that job by saying, Oh, I'm out like a Taykewondow, like fifth degree and I have all these great kicks, and then they watch you kick and you're not doing it, they're like all right, so, like what's to deal with this guy? You just ended getting blacklisted forever. You know, it's just one of those things where people just your reputation starts to stuff really bad. I like that about the stunt community, that that you could hold people to their to their word and, like you know, it's it's like that respect aspect of martial arts where you know if you're going to say something, you should be able to back it up. You know that. Sure that was more alive and prevalent, I would say, and stunts then what I was finding hanging around with a lot of the actors, that is, with not that all actors like that, but a lot of the ones that I was encountering. They weren't as as honest about their skill sets is as I feel like some people were, and as also because, you know, their job is to sort of be be more, you know, they have to appropriate themselves to something, whereas, like some people, it's like you have very specific job. Come in, you do these moves, you fall down, you're hired to do these things, and so you know, yeah, you should be one hundred percent fully confident in those sorts of sorts of deals. But you know, because of that, when you're in the gym, you're training with all these people, I mean you're just spending hours and hours and hours, like working with them and then you're seeing them on set all the time. Like what I would say about like with acting to is that you might be competing for like one role against all these different people and you know, you know, I want the the one guy that comes in and says the line or something, even if it's like two or three lines, and then this happens whatever. But you know, the villain could have. There's a fight scene where like the hero comes in and fights like, you know,...

...twenty of the goons of the villain has and then you're sitting there with like nineteen of your buddies and there's not that competition as much. You know, it's like you're you're counting on the fact that you're going to show up on the day and you're going to see all these familiar faces and be like Oh dude, like hey, I'm working in forever, like Oh, said, what are you doing in the scene? Like you know in your and just know each other, because you all sort of travel and packs and you're going to bump in each other all the time, and that that to me, is so fun and so cool about stunts, because you do sort of start to feel like you're a big family you know, and and I think everyone in the community sort of like understands that, even across like international borders. You know, the people that I met on extraction, like we're we're still buddies, we still talking you. I'll send them memes and what not all the time and if they post something, call them all like Oh, dude, that was sick, like can you teach me how to do that some day? You know whatever. Yeah, and then you're getting that kind of global network building up as you move along where, yeah, people that I talked to or I you know, I finally in person like maybe after like several years of following them, like I find out like Oh, they've watched like videos of me and stuff, and I'm like Oh man, cool, like it's great that we're finally getting the meet even though we've never actually seen each other like facetoface until just now. So, yeah, it's pretty cool. And the Inter it's really good about bringing that together, you know, the social media aspect of it now. Yeah, definitely. I mean that's how, like I said, that's how you and I connected, and that's pretty cool. Yeah, you go now. You touched on a couple of things that I had wanted to ask you in in terms of stunt fighting, because I've watched a couple videos. I'm I also like to dabble in like film making and like videography, so I've actually filmed a fight scene for for a video that my fiance and I did, and I learned a little bit about the the angles that you have to work with. Is there something like, is there one particular part of filming of fight scene that's harder for you or that's like the most different than actual martial arts fighting or sparring? Yeah, you're one thing that sticks out. What I'll say is that and I and I of course, I think I had to make the same jump to but like, if you train and like real martial arts, a lot of times you're sort of idea like contact and, depending on how you train to and stuff, the the idea like overwhelming someone or like countering someone, etcetera, etc. There's like a certain, I guess I go, a rhythm and like an instinct that goes with like real martial arts. You know that, even if you're just hitting, it's like there's a very specific way that you're sort of and you just feel it. If you're like you know if you're doing it all the time. But if you take that rhythm and you put it into like a fight scene that's like choreographed, everyone sort of knows what it's supposed to be. It has to move in connection with the the camera. Hard me your rhythm can be totally off sometimes. You know, I think a lot of a lot of what I'll give his advice to like, you know, sort of newer stunt performers or people's, you know, just kind of come into it who have like a strong fight background, is that it's all a dance and you sort of mentioned earlier, it's like everything's a dance and like not only just with the performers but also the camera. And you know, if you're fast, if you're strong, those are all great qualities. It's just that, you know, some people can jump the gun and it's like hey, that that punch was really great, but like we didn't see it because the camera wasn't even looking at you yet. And they're like Oh, you know, it's like, well, how much was no where the cameras. It's like, well, that's an experience thing. You you sort of feel it out and it's you know, it's about knowing when the right angle is going to be on it and things like filling the space. You know, it's if it's two people fighting one person and like this person gets punched in the head and then I have like four beats with this person, it's like, well, like, guy's got like me. So it call it agg you know, he's got a on his face, he's not doing anything. He just egg and out. You know, it's like you got hit in the head once. He has nothing to do. Is like help me, I got I'm like reacting to the same punch. You know. It's like, well, maybe that guy's got to be like okay, well, while we're doing this punch, if I duck underneath this, maybe he throws like a kick. We called it a ghost, you know. So it's like it looks like they're still trying to fight, so they're not just sitting. are going like my head still, you know, but they know that this person's completely occupied over here. They just throw it when they know they have a chance to be open, and it's just...

...that feel of it, in the flow of that, you know. So when you start explaining at the people, it's like Oh, okay, cool. It really is more like a dance than it is a like a fight, and that that dance still needs to be done with a fight energy, you know, which is why, you know, real fighters they can still become really great performers, you know, when you started start breathing them into that and like rehearsing them in the right way and training them. But that should always be like the sole focus, and I think some people it's it really is two different hats, you know, real martial arts and and fake martial arts, you know, like Hollywood food. It's you have to be good at like kind of taken one hand out, putting one head on, and I mean like all right, cool, now I know what I'm supposed to be doing here. Yeah, but yeah, that would be the sort of the main aspect of obviously everything else kind of comes with with experience, but I think it's you know, they say practice makes perfect, and the truth this is that the right kind of practice will make perfect, you know. So if you're training with that mentality in mind of like, okay, we're shooting this thing and we want it to feel like a real fight scene, and so we're going to use real fights and stuff in it, but we also know that it's totally fake. So let's figure out a way to fool the audience the right way. You know, then you're in the right Ballpark, and that's that's a hard distinction sometimes, you know. I think that's that's a thing that has to be talked about between, you know, your action designers and your directors and, you know, obviously, if you're if you're filmmaking, you're a martial artist like yourself, you know, and you're get it. Kind of getting into that stuff and winning the crap something really cool and really special and and make it sort of visceral and play to the audience the right way. Then it it does take a lot of like thought and care and kind of coordinating a lot of moving pieces, you know, between your performers and your camera and you know, lighting and sound and be edit and everything. You know. So it's that's yeah, again, you're always you're always telling a story with it. So, you know, making use of all the components of telling that story is where it really starts a shine. It's where you'll see people come forward, as you know, by coordinators, by choreographers, filmmakers, etc. That's awesome. So have you ever accidentally punched or kicked somebody or gotten yourself punch are kicked hunter. One of the Times of times, I don't even know if I can count them, might be because I got hit the head so many to no, no, I'm just kidding. No, like you know, that's that's one of the things we're with stunts and with fights. You know, even like the simplest stunt, which could just be like someone throwing a punch of somebody or whatever. You know, your your job as a stunt performer and as a you know, or as a coordinate or any kind like that. We all have to mitigate the risk as much as we can't, you know, we're trying to funnel it down to that way. There's not a lot of stuff that can go wrong, but the truth is that there will always you can never completely destroy that possibility. There's always possibly that something could go, you know, wrong. There's so many variables and that you know, even if it's something that you have accounted for, it could still happen. You know, I used to say that, like everything you know, you can you can do everything perfectly and it can still go to crap. You know what I mean, right and it's about having the right people who can, who can adjust to that moment, you know, like in the middle of it as well. But yeah, I've absolutely tagged people and I've been tagged by other people. You know, some sometimes on accident, sometimes when you know, purpose, and stuff like that too. It's like you know, Oh yeah, you're going to get hit by this one. You know it's going to be some positive contact. You're going to feel it, but then you have to prepare for it make sure that you know you're not just getting caught underwear, is getting knocked out or anything like that. But yeah, yeah, the tons of times and you'll do it'll even with your buddies, like when you're rehearsing like practice fight to something at that you're shooting like out in a park or like an a doge or something. You're just plat playing all the stuff, and one you guys will accidentally forget a beat and then get hit in the head. You like man it. It happens. You know, we all just sort of accept that it's gonna be the case. I tend to get hitting the groin a lot somehow. I have no idea why. It's just weird. It's weird, but'll anytime, like something goes off, it's it's somehow headed straight to my groin and that's like the worst. Is, like you gotta give me like five minutes. I'm to be down for a bit and hard. Good see that that's happened with me. But usually when I'm teaching my students, I can count quite a few times because they're all, you know, younger their kids. Yeah, and they either just don't have the flexibility to hit me in the stomach or they just don't care enough, and I've gotten tag there quite a few times. I'm just like I used to teach kids for years and it's talking about there's like...

...this weird thing where, like when they're like a certain age, like kind of right at the height were like their face level is like right at your belt, and you're like yeah, man, if you're sparring them, and it's always going to happen, you're like sparring the kids, like try to teach them and stuff, and then you know you're trying. You're the black belt and you're making sure that you're like giving them things to learn off of, like okay, he remember you. You want to block this thing until and at some point they're going to they're going to do it and just out of habit just whack hit you right back to like you don't even have to be that strong or dry or no to like hurt. It's like, you know, it's a six year old just blast you and you're like I'm going to be down for a while, and everyone loves it. Everyone laughs, like all these kids laughing at you, while you're like rolling on the floor like okay, I hope, I hope no one else saw that. I just got eaten by it. I just got outpointed by a six yearol them on the ground crying. Now. Yeah, I actually did that as a student. Now, I started martial arts when I was a little older, as like eleven, but we were sparring and it was one of the instructors who I actually still maintain a friendship with to this day. But he and I were sparring and he was younger at the time, so he had just gotten like frosted tips or something like orange frosted. Yeah, right. So somebody had come into the school and said to him, Hey, Jason, nice, nice hair, and he stopped sparring and dropped his hands. So I just threw a roundhouse kick right to his stomach and he goes like just doubles over and everybody's just like laughing and pointing and I just felt like the biggest ass. I've seen that happen a whole bunch of times. I've been the person that's that's done all three of those parts too. So I really build. Yeah, but that's that's another great thing, like the same thing that you're talking about with the stunting community, I feel in the martial arts community, because I started when I was eleven years old. I trained up until I was about nineteen or so and then I stopped and you know, life happened. I moved away, I gained a ton of weight and I never went back and then maybe two years ago, at this point, I had dropped all my weight. I had dropped close to eighty pounds. Wow, and yeah, and I wound up going back to the karate school because I was like I want to get the next belt. I'd say karate, but it was it's tongs Todo that I trained. Yeah, yeah, I feel yeah, it's showed Kan from Korea. Yeah, right, yeah, so I went back. I wanted to get my next belt, so I like reddicated myself to my training and I said, it was kind of like a it filled a gap that I didn't realize that I was missing, because it was just all these people that I hadn't seen in years. There were former students who now are either the same rank as me or outranked me. But it didn't matter because, yeah, it is weird, really weird, but I've done I've done that to some of my instructors to that. So, but it's just such a great community and they didn't care that I was gone for ten years. They just were happy that I was back, you know. So it's a really cool community. I really like that about martial arts. Yeah, definitely to me, man, that's awesome. Good for you. I I went there was a similar weight lost thing when I was in high school. Like I had been like slightly like kind of like depressed. Like I we moved away from like the place where I grown up and your military family and we got transferred out to the middle of the country where I, you know, I didn't have any friends. All of a sudden, you know, I was like it was like like twelve years old, nake. Over the course of twelve to fifteen I gained so much weight and then yeah, I'll I remember the exact time when I looked in the mirror and in June or when I was it was in a high school as a freshman, and I was like that's weird. Why am I school photos? Like I bought like a shirt for school photos up that you were coming up it, like you know that first month where either're going to take class photos or whatnot, and I was like why do I like I bought this new shirt, but I feel like I look not great in it. I was like what's going on? I was like looking in the mirror and I'm like, Oh, I think I'm like overweight now, like Oh, I think I like I completely lost my like athletic sort of like youth. Like I...

...feel like I look like like I don't care about myself. And so, yeah, like over the from fifteen to sixteen, like over the course of that year. I remember running on my first mile in gym class like that winter and it was like think I finished like a thirty, like I literally was like dying. I remember that had like Walf the like half of it. I was like this is so embarrassing. Guys are just like lapping you on their third miles. There or whatever. But yeah, then that I ended up losing like sort of like walking tune from school. I lost like a ton of weight. I I lost close around the same amountain. I ended up like one like like one thirty like at the by the time summer break started. And then random mile my during summer school or whatever before my sophomore year, and I think I ran it like a like an eight, like a forty five or something that close to eight minutes. I was like wow, that's weird. It's so much better when you're right, you know, when you're good at it, and all this extra stuff. You know. So you know that's like Bondi Cheam won or anything like that. You know this is it is. I was definitely I definitely become overweight from just being sad and sitting around playing too many video games and like not going out and exercising and stuff like eating the wrong yeah, yeah, and it and it becomes a vicious cycle at some point too, because for me specifically, like you get upset that you're like, Oh man, I'm putting on all this way. Yeah, but then you don't go to the gym or do anything to like sort of combat it, and it's just like like, and it just gain more weight and then, yeah, more sad. Well, and and that's where something like like martial arts really helped me out a lot to see it. You know, I was one of those guys where if you told me to go to the gym, it just didn't make sense to me at the time. You know, like nowadays, like I, I sort of love it. You and I look going to the gym because it you can get yourself like a focal point, something that you got to work on, you know. But for me that was martial arts initially, which was that it's very easy to be like, okay, objectively, I want to get this kicked down and there's always technical components to it and if I just practice, practice, practice, I'm going to get it right. And the eventually that becomes your exercise and you don't even realize. You sort of feel like you're just doing something to get better at it and then not realizing like Oh yeah, I'm using my body for all this stuff and it is pretty athletically demanding. So that's a huge part of me staying in shape and getting in better shape throughout the years. was was training, you know, just training my butt off yeah, and and that's kind of the the other question that I was going to ask you. What is sort of your like nutrition or workout routine look like these days, because I've seen you post like some some like snacks and some baking stuff that you do on your instagram story. Man, yeah, but I was, I but I was also curious as to like I totally lost the question. But yeah, just like your workout regiment and things. Yeah, I mean I'm I always considered that if you're stunt performer, if you're in that whole thing, then you you owe it's yourself. It's like your job to train, you know what I mean, your job to be athletic, essentially, and be able to do the skills you're supposed to do. So I'll almost always try to get up go to the gym in the morning. If I missed too much in the morning, so I'm like at work doing work or anything like that, I'll all at least go like in the afternoon or something like that. Obviously, the gym is nowadays just like your apartment or your garage or whatever, right, or a park where you know six feet from everybody else, or you know, sometimes you're in like a place where there's a safe gym. You know, if you have like a safe set up for it, then you know, by all means, but the yeah, I'll I'll spend at least at least two to three hours, if not more, like you know, doing just general fitness stuff and then, you know, I'll pick like a skill or something that I it might feel like really shady on. Like the other day I was in the hotel gym and there's some space out, so I just pull my shoes off started doing my kicks. I'm like, Oh, you cool, look up for a minute straight. I'm going to do like round as kicks on each side, roundhouse backstep, around us backs, that round as backstep. I do if like a minute straight and then, like you take thirty sings rest in the next one is like back kick, good bat kick, back back it jump, back kick, over and over and over again, just doing those things. You know, before you know, like twenty minutes we've gone by and you're throwing like, you know, like...

...spinhook kick, not a bond, like spinhook kick or whatever, switching sides, do the other way and what have you. And it's the reason why I was doing that was because I was like my kicks kind of suck now, like I felt like my kids were getting really bad. I could just feel like being lads. I'm like, I'm not flexible for some reason anymore, like I so I I just took too much time off and I was working on like some other kind of like fitness stuff. So let me get that back, you know. Then I'll go through that like in cycles. You get your kicks to a decent stage after a while. Okay, now I'll work on like some of my grappling and whatnot, you know, like do all these Jiu Jitsu drills instead of these resting drills, what have you. You know, and for me that's kind of always you know, what it should be is that, you know, anyone can be in good shape, but to be like kind of functionally fit for your job specifically is also very important, you know, and so it's like kind of like research those skills, figure them out and then work in aspect of that almost all the time, you know, even if it's just like a Jilly the ladder junk or like you're hitting MIT's, like, you know, it's all stuff that you can use to kind of get your skill set up high. I think for most people, like you know, being fit is just more it's more important for health reasons obviously, and then esthetics. And Yeah, for us, I think a lot of it is more about like Jackie chance that in my stunts. You know, he's like, you know he you have to be light yet to be fast. You know, you have feeble to be, you know, to do all of these techniques and stuff. It's great documentary. It's pretty old nowadays, but I mean there's still some really good stuff in there. You know, back when we had access to stunt Jim's, you know, some of that stuff would be just going to the gym and throwing all your acrobatics, you know, like I'm going to spend just the entire time, you know, after I run and do some weights, spend like an hour straight just working on variations of like backflips or sometimes just like faults, you know, like you're going to have to reckon hit the ground everything. You do that a bunch of times and that becomes your fitness and stuff too. For me, that's where I like to do, is I like to put those skill sets along with the Exercise Regiment, so that way, at least half of the time, that I'm spending doing exercise is spent working on like a technique that I know I'm going to use, you know, on camera or like in training somebody or something, you know, just brand new that you know you're trying to learn and get down, which, you know, when you're learning a new skill, it helps. Helps a lot because you're like you're again, you're trying to really get it down. Fog your mind so you forget that you're doing all these reps and everything like that. Yeah, as far as diet, I'm pretty bad at that stuff. I try to be. I try to get good as I can, but for the most part I I will, I will exercise and then be like all right, cool, I got that out of the way. Now I can go eat this in and out, which is right. You know, it's just it's just what's gonna happen like half the time. You know what I mean. But yeah, for the most part I tried it. I try to keep it fairly you know, help they try to avoid like too many, too many carbloads and stuff you and too much like red meat and everything. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and I'm fairly decent into like supplements and stuff to you know, like for like just get doing like protein shakes and whatnot is like one of the meals the day. My getting older now and stuff too, is like the point where the metabolism is definitely like slowed a lot from, you know, when I was like my s and everything. So just trying to be careful about that. But as far as the baking stuff goes, I actually used to bake a lot when I was like a like a kid, you know, up through like middle school and everything like that. So it was a really cool hobby. I always thought it would be like this. It's almost like science like type things. I was a little nerd when I was a kid, so I loved like chemistry and like just like anything that had to do with mixing compounds together and watching them become something else, and baking was sort of like that. It's like a science experiment that you get to eat afterwards, which is that was cool and I'm like, I'm sure this makes me very, very handsome and cool and study to everybody. It's like, you know that I'd chow up with like a pie or something like what. Like you can't bend anything, you just you just have like pies everywheys. What's over, that. But yeah, I got back into it, obviously because the the whole corn thing and then happening. I sort of watching that great British baking show. Yeah, and I was all, I all right. It's sort of rejuvenated the interest in it and while it can get very expensive to like try out new recipes because you're buying new ingredients and then failing a lot of the time and then throwing sight away, it was really fun. So for a while that I was like yeah, kind of get back into it, and I and realize there's so much stuff I didn't realize about it. But that's that's sort...

...of like a kind of a cool hobby thing and trying to make those and then half the time I'll just give that stuff to other people because I write right, I don't. I don't need too many cakes in the house. If they're in the house, I'll eat them and that'll be a problem. So I got to make sure I give you off to somebody else. I hear you. I hear you. Now we're you part of that? The Sour Dough bread baking phase of quarantine? Did you hit that at all? Know, yeah, I didn't quite get into the whole bread thing just because, you know, there's like get like prove it and everything like that, like wait for it and stuff. I'm like very impatient like a lot of the times, you know. So feel that. Yeah, I know I didn't get to become to go into the whole bread thing because it just seems like, Oh, that requires some real craftsmanship of skill. Again, when it comes to baking, while I love it, I'm most definitely a hack. So any of those photos that I put up are most likely it's one of those hey, I tried kind of, kind of right, right, that's about as good as it's ever going to get. So, yeah, I didn't want to overstep my bounds and set myself up with too much failure by joining the bread real all right, probably, probably, I'll probably try it at some point in time during this year and those old cool be spectacular failures and I'll make sure to post all those as well. Awesome, awesome, I love it, all right. So we talked a little bit about extraction. We talked to a lot of bit about martial arts and stunting and all that stuff. I don't want to take up too too much of your time here, so I just want to do a couple of rapid fire questions. Sure, what is your favorite kick to throw? Oh God, that's like such a that's like asking like what a favorite child is. It's so hard to do. You can, I'll, I'll caveat you. Can. You can tell me your least favorite if you want, because mind's a hook kick. I Hate Hook kicks. Oh, really right, I don't have the hip flexibility to I'll say that if I throw a hook kick it's got to be a spinning back one, trying to do a front leg hook kick. I hate them. Oh Man, you know what I maybe I'm a little bit old school about it. I just for the feel of it. I love throwing real leg sidekick, just high, really excite kick, nice and tight. You get that clean chamber, like knee to the chest sort of thing. We're trying to like Yelad it up and it's explode out. I mean I feel like that always looks super cool and super powerful and like you can like kind of hit that pose something with like a like a like a tornado kick or whatever. Looks Great and it's in motion. It's awesome and I love those things to death, but they are they they are like this thing that's always in motion and so you can't really have to kind of kick a freeze moment, whereas I got a nice stiff sidekick when you just like hit it and hold it out there like you can just bet you could hang out and make that a trophy of someone and handed to a kid at a tournament. It's like, you know, that's to me when I think about my old masters, that's like the thing I that you see on the covers, like them doing the type side kick. I'm like some poor dude like flying away from it is if he got watched into the air. Yeah, play to those, say to the foot looks so good. You know. Yeah, they they are very, very pretty kicks. I do enjoy good sidekick. What are your thoughts on Cobra Kai? Have you seen any of it? I think it's great. I haven't seen the third season yet, but I I I was prepared to not like a lot of the aspects of it, just because I feel like when you take an old show and you have it close off then you restart it, you run the risk of like sort of betraying a lot of the stuff. You can ret connor like you know, betray like sort of the the feeling that the original one left you with, and you can reset character arts because you have to start them over and have them come back again. But I'm I'm a big fan of that show. I think they do such a good job. But the storytelling of it and, you know, kind of bringing the martial arts mythos and like how to approach it and stuff, even in like a what we call it condis traditional martial arts to a modern setting, like contemporate stuff, because obviously, like you know, why don't they just do name or something like that, you know, like they end have any ground game or whatever. It's. It's like, well, it's not the point. They're sort of introducing the whole Croti aspect and and it's weirdly nostalgic in a way that's very refreshing, which, you know, as someone who remembers the originals like I,...

I really love that they've tried to updated it and they've done such a good job out with it. I think the acting, it's really really great. Things smartly written. Yeah, I'm a big fan of Corpe gay awesome. Yeah, season three was great. If you get a chance, I'm working or sting, I'm gonna Binge it for sure when I get the time. Absolutely. So, what is one of the a what is one of your favorite shows to binge, whether it's whether it's like an original series or film or, you know whatever. It doesn't even have to be Netflix. It could be like prime video, I don't know. Oh, yeah, besides the besides the great British making show. Yeah, yeah, besides that one, the one that I binged a lot, like back when it was on. I remember I've been bojack horseman hard every time that it every day. The day that it came out was the day that I watched all of it and was immediately sad for the you know, waiting for the next season to come out, like I could not stop. But that one, it was fantastic. Okay, that's awesome. And if you could be part of like a bucket list project for you, like what is one job, whether it's a stunt job or an acting job or anything, well, you would want to be a part of. There's like so many of those, but I I would say that for me, I feel like I say, I would say a lot like that's anyway, but I'm just really, really aware of it. But I've always been a huge treky, a huge star Trek Fan. My Dad guy like watch him when I was a kid. He introduced me to it and like, since I was like five years old, watch all of them. Huge Fan of like the next generation everything. But I yeah, I I definitely love the way that that series has has been updated and stuff throughout the years. And Man, I before I die I'm be on some star trek stuffing do something start correct. I really, really love it. I really love that stuff, like no matter, no matter what it in, what regard it's going to be in. But yeah, I just want to be able to say that in at least you know, tell my my pops like Hey, dad, I come, I'm doing star track and stuff is he'd flip his lid. Yeah, man, put it out there in the universe. You know, that's really cool. Yeah, and if you see any right, have you seen any of that discovery show that's on? I think it's on CBS all access? No, I actually know. I work with one of the like the main actor in it. Okay, that's one with the once into it and right main actors in it. Anyway, I'm if it's the one I'm thinking of, I can look it up right now. I don't want it. I don't want to say it wrong and be all like Oh, I mean shrugging. But I haven't I don't know who the people are in this new oh I just I just looked it up and it was totally it was totally right. Yeah, the this girl's Sinequa, who's like the the leader it. Yeah, I work at their weirdly, in like a theater show ages ago, and so it was like I should beiest thing to see her like in this, you know, obviously like taking the helm on it. I was like that's so cool. You know, it's like really, really cool. I haven't, to my shame, I haven't had the chance to like watch a whole bunch of it yet, but you know, I'm I thought it look pretty pretty sick from what I was, you know, seeing just in my clips and everything. Yeah, my dad's a huge star Trek Fan as well. I kind of fell onto the star wars side of things, but I do, I do appreciate star check. So I'll have to give it it the view, I guess. Yeah, I said I was a huge trekking and then I may just be a huge treky of like the older stuff now I think abouts. I feel like I immediately did what I just said about it. Don't worry, no judgment here. Yeah, and yeah, no problem. And I am weirdly aware of the fact that I say that's funny without actually laughing at things sometimes. So it's just like you're like the whole everyone's got those little catch raises are always doing. It's just you can take your habit. You always pop them out. So tell it. Tell everybody where they can find you on social if they want to check out some of your stuff.

Yeah, I mean I got on Facebook, although I don't check it quite as much, but my instagram is handle is at art of Legitsu, art of LG it Su. I don't know how to spell apparently I couldn't remember that, but yeah, you can just find me on there and then that's I don't update too much. You'll get the subscribe to that. You're going to see some really bad baking things some point. I'm yeah, and I was. I was check it out your youtube channel to you. Definitely gotta put an updated stunt real out there, man. Oh, last one's from two thousand and sixteen. I think I was sixteen. I've that's a thing where we this is a weird tangent but, like you know, it's some performers. I feel like we're always in this constant process of because you'll do a job and you'll do something, you'll get a great gag on it and be like Oh, cool, that's going in the real and by the time it's time to make a real, like that thing has to come out, like I really want to save you know, like I want to wait until that clip from Logan is ready and then I'll put it in my reel to open it. You're going to say that forever and then all the sudden you realize you never update and then at some point you're too busy to update it and then nothing right, which is terrible. That's like our business card. That's the that's one of the main ways we get work. Is like a you should absolutely have an updated real at all times. If you're putting out an old real, it's like it should. It might be that like the reasons for that and had someone can't do anything anymore and I'm like, I'm like one of those guys who like the is it your responsible? Wasn't updated stuff, but yeah, I really do need to do and plus I'm always like trying to juggle what song to put to it. I have so many like choices and then it just ends up dying because I you know, it's like wouldn't, but you have too many options. Then you end up not watching anything at all. Use brows forever. So, yeah, well, well, that's part of why I created the podcast. I hope that, like by talking about some of these shows that are out there on the streaming service, like somebody actually finds something that they want to watch and, you know, find their next favorite film or their next favorite show. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's smart, that's super cool. Yeah, but I definitely love to have you back because we haven't even scratches the surface of like all this stuff that you've been in. When I was what, I was prepping for this interview and I pulled up your imdv page, I was like, all right, he's probably been like a couple things, you know whatever, and then I just see this long list of like seventy four different jobs. I'm like, wait, he's been in on Wick, he was in like the fast and furious movies, like we haven't even touched it. And you said Logan. That was probably one of my favorite xmen movies that came out. It was so well done. Oh yeah, that was a that was a big experience for me. That was a huge one. I talked a lot about it to this day just because it sort of changed a lot of the way I feel about just what we do and like our industry, you know. And and it was I had joke to the buddy of mine that you know, we USA always say like Oh, once you like get on like a marvel film, you know, for like a long time, like you know, that's that's what you've made it. You know, like when you Max out on a marvel film, that'll be it. You you'll know you've made it. I got obviously after Logan. I was like and make it. That's not the end of my career, like what he's talking about, like that's just run job that we had. It's like war work all the time. But but I remember going to the tell a weird, stupid story about that. So like well, you know, I worked really, really hard on Logan. I was very, very blessed to get into that, but it was very demanding. was very, very hard and I left a lot of myself on there. There's a gag that I did for it where it's in the end when he's he injects himself and he comes running through. Sorry, spoiler if anyone who hasn't seen this movie. That came out in two thousand and seventeen, but he right. Yeah, he injects himself. He he berserker barrajes out like the war last time, you know, as the old Logan, basically, and and he just running through guys. When he first shows up there's a part where he kind of runs up a guy and spins around him and like slams them on his neck and then kills him. And that's that's me. You go to instagram and see it. It's this we called the Crucifix Slam. It's just this crazy thing in my my buddy Steve Brown was the fike coordinator on it. You know, he was like sort the only guy that could who was, you know, the the right like body type and had the athletics of the get up there and do it, you know, like we're our height. You like your heights kind of have to match in a certain weird way, and it just lined up that it was. It was perfect like that he could do it. So he stepped in for basically that that gag and nailed me on it.

Man, it was a while and we rehearsed that so many times to make sure that we you know, we could. We could pitch it to the to the director and everything. It made it to the film like the Final Cut, which was amazing that, like something that starts at the beginning of a film in the stunt process makes it over to the end, and the fact that we got it. I was telling him like to like, I want that gag, like we were hearsed it and it was very important to me that, like, if we're, if it's going to be in there, like I want to be the guy that does it. You know, it's kind of kind of a selfish thing, but you know, I felt like I had left a lot of myself on that show and I wanted to claim back a little bit of that too, you know, by showing it off on Cameron. You know, we did it and it was amazing and then I went to like the the week that it released, I was in New York working on a TV show and I went and saw it by myself at this theater and I was like super stoked out. Actually, I might have seen it with like no, I think I saw with a buddy, but like he was not involved by the film industry, so it was just kind of like Oh, cool, he's watching a movie. But we were watching it and I was like waiting for it and I'm like this is going to be such a I wonder if it's going to be in the film. And then it happened and it was a huge slam and I was all like yes, I stood up. I was like yeah, my cheers and like no one in the theater care. They were like what, who's that crazy guy? He's very loud, and I was like, Oh, I'm gonna sit back down. No one cares. But yeah, it was like one of those weird moments where like it meant so much to me and like in the theater is like I'm one of like fifty guys taking crazy big rex and it's like everyone else's is like way cooler than mine. Like a yeah, I'm still going to be proud of it, and I think that's right, an indication of in this industry in general just you know, we all have to sort of pick our moments of being like proud. There's there's a great quote from from actor I'm going to miss attribute it, so I won't even try to remember who it was, but it said something like every every job you do, essentially is that you leave a little bit of your soul in there and every now and then you'll get some of it bad, sometimes you'll get it. You'll get some of it back on a job and I felt like I poured a lot of it into that show and then I felt like I didn't get too much of that back. I still felt like a given more than I received and when I saw that move in theaters, all of a sudden, like everything just felt right for a moment. I was like that's pretty sick. I feel pretty good as a stunt man now. Yeah, that is really cool. Confidently stored. Now, do you often watch a lot of your work, like after it's finished? Do you do you go back and watch the finished product? I try to sometimes. I like, you know, if I'm Onli one day where I come in and then I'm off, like I sometimes I don't get the catch it, but you know, it's a lot of times I'll try to watch because, like the whoop thing is I'm like, I'm I'm an action movie, like not, I just love action movies. So I fun in something. It's probably something that I'm going to want to watch later on anyway, just because it's an action film or something. And you know, I always when I come on camera, I'll always be like I should have done that better, but then I'll watch all my other buddies and they'll do it and I'll be all like look how good they are. Sometimes it pulls you out of the Moon because you go and watch it, you see all the all your friends and it you know, like like look, there's my buddy. If like the nine million of time it's like, Oh, yeah, I should be watching a story and staid. But I try. I try to for sure, but I'd say almost every single time I do, I just sit and criticizing myself. The curse of the actor, right. It's probably what I'm gonna do when I go back and watch this interview. I'm probably it's it's the curse of it. Anybody who's WHO's really passionate, and I'd say I think most people who are really passionate about something they they always think of a way that they could have done it a little bit better, you know. So that's how it goes, though standard operating procedure absolutely well, Michael, I appreciate you coming on and taking the time to chat with me. I know we had a couple of rescheduling things to come bat here, but yeah, that's on me. I'd we actualize so thank you for being paid me now, man, it's all good. I'm super glad that we actually had the chance to sit down and connect. This has been awesome. Heck, yeah, she had a brother. Yeah, no problem, man. All right. Well, enjoy the rest of your trip and I will talk to you later. Absolutely catch on the next one, man. All Right, see...

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